Fadal Resource Thread

[Aaron Gough]

We finally have a Fadal specific sub-forum, hooray!

Attached are all the Fadal resources I have collected over the years, figured it would be good to have them all in one place.

The maintenance manual was too big to attach, so here is a link to the maintenance manual on my Google Drive:

Fadal-Maintenance-Manual.pdf

drive.google.com

Would be great if this could be made into a sticky!

 

[g-coder05]

What I would have given to have these 15 years ago. Pissed me off that the manuals were only available on the HD.

 

[Aaron Gough]

Yeah it's definitely useful to have them all available! If anyone is looking for any other info Fadal related please let me know, I have gotten good at hunting stuff down!

 

[chad883]

Yeah it's definitely useful to have them all available! If anyone is looking for any other info Fadal related please let me know, I have gotten good at hunting stuff down!

I have a question for you then. I have a 3016 box way machine 10k RPM. I can only achieve 1/2 the RPM available for each gear. So in high gear it will max at 5k, in low gear it will max at 1k RPM (not exactly sure what the top speed for low gear is). I assume it is a spindle drive issue, but not sure.

Thanks

 

[Aaron Gough]

I have a question for you then. I have a 3016 box way machine 10k RPM. I can only achieve 1/2 the RPM available for each gear. So in high gear it will max at 5k, in low gear it will max at 1k RPM (not exactly sure what the top speed for low gear is). I assume it is a spindle drive issue, but not sure.

Thanks

Unfortunately I have never run a gearbox machine, however I'm curious if it has wye-delta switching for the spindle motor in addition to the gearbox? If so the contactor might be stuck which would only allow the 'low' range of the spindle motor...

If you post a photo of the inside of the rear cabinet where the spindle drive is we might be able to help out!

Might be worth checking the parameters for the spindle are set correctly as well!

 

[Delw]

That sounds like a drive not set up right like aaron said, as there is no gear box to my knowlegde on any fadal machine, they used the same belt system from the very beginning unless they changed something in the last 5-8 years.
post a picture of your belt system while your at it. Maybe its mickey moused

 

[Delw]

I bet I have 10-15 fadal complete manuals here at the shop, for some reason I never threw them away since 1993. its easier for me to comprehend on printed stuff than digital stuff

 

[Aaron Gough]

That sounds like a drive not set up right like aaron said, as there is no gear box to my knowlegde on any fadal machine, they used the same belt system from the very beginning unless they changed something in the last 5-8 years.
post a picture of your belt system while your at it. Maybe its mickey moused

There are some Fadals that have a low/high 'gearbox'. They actually use a system of tensioned belts instead of a gearbox with gears, but I believe they do indeed exist! That said I have not personally seen/run/worked on one so my ability to help in this case might be limited... Won't stop me from trying though!

 

[ripperj]

What are you using to determine the speed? You can get a cheap optical(non contact ) tach that Comes with a pc of reflective tape that you stick on the spindle . I had to get one when I was having drive issues( the prior owner hosed up all the VFD settings)

if you are using the VFD display, it reads out motor speed , not the spindle( on the Baldor anyway)

 

[chad883]

There are some Fadals that have a low/high 'gearbox'. They actually use a system of tensioned belts instead of a gearbox with gears, but I believe they do indeed exist! That said I have not personally seen/run/worked on one so my ability to help in this case might be limited... Won't stop me from trying though!

Yes, this is the set-up I have on mine. No actual gears, just a different belt engaged for high/low.

What are you using to determine the speed? You can get a cheap optical(non contact ) tach that Comes with a pc of reflective tape that you stick on the spindle . I had to get one when I was having drive issues( the prior owner hosed up all the VFD settings)

if you are using the VFD display, it reads out motor speed , not the spindle( on the Baldor anyway)

Not verified speed, but the sight and sound quits changing at 5000 RPM in high gear. That is half the top speed. I thought it was probably a drive setting, but have not been able to check the drive settings. it is not a baldor. I will have to check into the Wye contactor

 

[Herding Cats]

Don't know anything about Fadals but if it's anything like a Fanuc there are oodles of parameters for the spindle including clamping speeds for different gear ratios

 

[Aaron Gough]

Don't know anything about Fadals but if it's anything like a Fanuc there are oodles of parameters for the spindle including clamping speeds for different gear ratios

Fadals are, thankfully, a lot simpler. There is only a couple of parameters related to the spindle: speed, gearbox type, orientation factor, rigid tap, rigid tap factor, and maybe a couple of others... If the gearbox type or the speed are set incorrectly that could certainly cause this issue, however I think it's more likely related to a contactor issue or a spindle encoder issue or something...

 

[Delw]

Fadal has a whopping 1-2 pages of prms thats it.
its easy to check the rpm, look at the back of the drive and see what the disply is reading. it reads if I recall have the speed of the actually spindle RPM in high gear.
if your going by that for your RPM then your numbers are more than likely wrong. IN low gear its the same as the back of the rpm on the drive.

the high speed will be DOUBLE the RPM read on the back of the drive, your motor never turns faster 5k if I recall check the motor rateing

 

[Herding Cats]

Is there no arrival signal that would trigger an alarm if the contactor didn't switch and then the spindle would not be turning the commanded speed?

 

[Aaron Gough]

Is there no arrival signal that would trigger an alarm if the contactor didn't switch and then the spindle would not be turning the commanded speed?

Nope... Fadals are dirt simple machines, which brings both good and bad qualities. I have witnessed my VMC10 with a sticky wye/delta contactor thinking that it was in high range when in fact it was in low range. No alarms or anything, just a broken tool!

 

[Delw]

The fadal spindle speed of the motor is operated via dc volts. up to 10 volts or 12 volts forget which one.
you can run your spindle on a fadal with a 9 volt battery and a rheostat ( I have for a few months while waiting on a warrenty drive that losts its voltage signal the guy told me how to hook it up was pretty cool.)

dont worry about high gear at all,as its working correctly it doubles. because your low gear is messed up if you cant get max low rpms and when switching to high gear the main motor goes the same spead the belts double it.
I am betting he has an old baldor drive they only last so long. we had one that would just ramp up slow down, turned out being a drive, no alarms nothing and unless you werent at the machine or changng a part you would have never noticed it.

 

[chad883]

The fadal spindle speed of the motor is operated via dc volts. up to 10 volts or 12 volts forget which one.
you can run your spindle on a fadal with a 9 volt battery and a rheostat ( I have for a few months while waiting on a warrenty drive that losts its voltage signal the guy told me how to hook it up was pretty cool.)

dont worry about high gear at all,as its working correctly it doubles. because your low gear is messed up if you cant get max low rpms and when switching to high gear the main motor goes the same spead the belts double it.
I am betting he has an old baldor drive they only last so long. we had one that would just ramp up slow down, turned out being a drive, no alarms nothing and unless you werent at the machine or changng a part you would have never noticed it.

It is a glentek drive. I don't think it even has a display on it. I am only confirming speed by sight and sound. If I increase the speed by 500 RPM in MDI, I can tell that it does not increase beyond 5k. When the low "gear" belt is engaged I can tell it only increases to half of the RPM it should before switching to high gear. I am not sure, but I believe it only gets up 1250 in low gear, then at 2501 it switches to high. At 2501 RPM I can tell it will increase as programmed up to 5k, but that is the max. These speeds may be off a bit since this is from memory. Only ran a couple of jobs across it this year and they are already programmed within the restraints of this issue,

Thanks

 

[Delw]

It is a glentek drive. I don't think it even has a display on it. I am only confirming speed by sight and sound. If I increase the speed by 500 RPM in MDI, I can tell that it does not increase beyond 5k. When the low "gear" belt is engaged I can tell it only increases to half of the RPM it should before switching to high gear. I am not sure, but I believe it only gets up 1250 in low gear, then at 2501 it switches to high. At 2501 RPM I can tell it will increase as programmed up to 5k, but that is the max. These speeds may be off a bit since this is from memory. Only ran a couple of jobs across it this year and they are already programmed within the restraints of this issue,

Thanks

speed and sight please explain? are you using a tach or what does your numbers say on the monitor?
if you have a 10k spindle and 10k drive and your getting only 1250 in low then you more than likely have a electrical problem like aaron was saying or a drive issue.
are you running on real 3 phase or a convertor

 

[chad883]

speed and sight please explain? are you using a tach or what does your numbers say on the monitor?
if you have a 10k spindle and 10k drive and your getting only 1250 in low then you more than likely have a electrical problem like aaron was saying or a drive issue.
are you running on real 3 phase or a convertor

When I MDI S2501 it engages the "high gear" pulley. The spindle stops, then a pneumatic cylinder moves a belt tensioner to engage a belt and disengage the other belt. Then the spindle motor starts running again. Then I can MDI S3000 and visually see the spindle runs faster. MDI S3500 and can see spindle speed up. Spindle keeps speeding up until 5000 RPM. Anything after that the control will accept, but the spindle does not go any faster.

Yes I am running 3 phase. I get 208V from the pole. (actually usually run 211-213V).

 

[Aaron Gough]

I'd definitely be curious to see a photo of the inside of the back cabinet. If the machine has a wye/delta contactor then I'm pretty sure it is going to be your problem... The Glentek drives are really good from what I've seen. Both of my machines have them and I've been very happy with them.